John Crouch Sr

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I ran across this document on the internet. It treats the David Crouch interview as fact and then proves it. Frankly I never put too much faith in the interview because of the comments at the end of the statement that indicated Mr. Crouch had a poor memory. I also though he was wrong about the year that Ben Logan rounded up the Indians. It turns out that much of the interview can be documented and the conclusion reached is that the primary books that documented the Crouch family during this period are simply incorrect in several important areas. Anyone interested in the Crouch History should read this document. I'm sure this isn't the final word on the subject, but it is certainly fresh thinking.

Also did everyone know "that part of Randolph County that later became Tucker County, was settled by John Crouch (the father of David Crouch)? The John Crouch cabin stood a half mile from the forks of the Cheat River, and a half mile from the city of Parsons, in Blackman Flats. WV Historical Marker, located near the South intersection of First and Main Streets in Parsons reads:
PARSONS, John Crouch, pioneer settler, established "tomahawk rights" here in 1766, the first settler of Tucker County WV."

I did not post all the research, since my interest is in David Crouch. There is a good deal more at http://patriot.net/~crouch/queries/wva.html

Dorothy Boyd and son Stephen made the trip to Parsons just to get me this picture. Thanks so much. Oddly, historian Hu Maxwell is generally not considered an accurate source of information regarding the Crouch family by the current researchers. See below.

 

From: randystalnaker@webtv.net (Mrs. Randy Stalnaker) {this email address is out of date]

Date: Mon, 7 Apr 2003

Subject: John Crouch Sr, [from Wales]

I would appreciate it if you would post the following on the John Crouch Sr. Family,

there is alot of confusion on this family, and several documents have recently been located that prove that Maxwell's History of Randolph County, WV, on the Crouch Family was incorrect, and that the information he gives listing John, Andrew, and James as brothers is wrong. Several documents have been found which contradict some of the assumptions made by Hu Maxwell, [ History of Randolph County, WV] and Homer Fansler, [ History of Tucker County, WV], about the family of John Crouch Sr. One document in particular is a record of an interview with David Crouch, son of John Crouch Sr, which substantiates and contradicts Fansler's information, [ David Crouch Interview, Draper Collection Manuscripts, Volume 12CC225-29, Nicholas County, Kentucky] Fansler had no information showing where John Crouch Sr. lived prior to his settlement on Cheat River in present Tucker County. David Crouch stated that his father lived some years on the South Branch, went from there to the Carolinas, lived two or three years on the Yadkin in the same section with Boone, then came back again to the South Branch. David described their settlement as being 50 miles from the South Branch with five mountains to cross going there that were so steep a horse could hardly carry a man over them.

David also said that "he was born in August 1767 on the heads of the Monongahela in Randolph County, Virginia and that his father was one of the first settlers there. His father came to Tygart's Valley when David was 3 years old." This part of his statement appears to be in agreement with Fansler's article. John Crouch's settlement in 1766 on the Cheat River, in present Tucker County, WV, would be considered on a head of the Monongahela. According to David his father moved to the Tygart's Valley in 1770 and not 1772 as Fansler concluded. Maxwell's and Fansler's theory that John Crouch Sr., Andrew Crouch and James Crouch were brothers and that Andrew had a mature son Joseph before coming to the area appears to be totally incorrect.

The name James Crouch first appears in Alexander Scott Wither's account of an Indian Ambush which occurred in Tygarts Valley,[ Withers, Alexander Scott, Chronicles of Border Warfare, 1895, pg. 287]. Withers states in his book that James Crouch was wounded during an Indian ambush in March 1780 when John Nelson, John McLean and James Ralston were killed. David Crouch named the same men as being killed in an ambush during which his brother Jonathon Crouch was shot through the arm. The name James Crouch does not appear in any of the early records of Randolph County.

During the interview David does not mention his father by name, however he does say that "the Commissioners appointed to adjust land claims sat a day or two at my Father's." The records of the Commissioners show that they met at John Crouch's on March 23 and 24 in 1780. David stated that Joseph Crouch was his older brother, therefore Joseph was a son of John Crouch and not Andrew Crouch as Fansler assumed.

Fansler's account of the circumstances surrounding the death of John Crouch Sr., also appears to be false. He states that John Crouch Sr. was killed by a rattlesnake bite at his home in Randolph County in 1787. David said that his father lived in Tygart's Valley for seventeen years and that he and his father came to Kentucky in 1787. David also said that when his father came to Kentucky, he bought 5 miles this side of Lexington, moved to Bourbon and from there to Ohio where he died. Fansler's reference to Deed Book 6, pages 659,663, and 665 for information on John Crouch Sr was found to be incorrect. These deeds were recorded in 1815 from John Crouch, [son of Andrew Crouch and Judith Westfall] Sheriff of Randolph County, and do not provide any information about John Crouch Sr. as Fansler states.

A petition by the inhabitants of the Tygart's Valley in 1776 shows John Crouch Sr, John Crouch Jr, Joseph Crouch, Jonathan Crouch, and Andrew Crouch were all living in the valley at the time. Records also show that Joseph Crouch was born in 1748, and Andrew was born in 1750, which also shows that they were brothers, not father and son. In the first census of Harrison County in 1785 the following were listed as living in the Tygarts Valley between Petty's Ford [near present day Valley Bend] and the County line, John Crouch Sr., John Crouch Jr., Jonathon Crouch, Jacob Crouch, Judy Crouch and Joseph Crouch. It appears that Judith Crouch, [Judy] was the widow of Andrew Crouch who died or was killed prior to 1782. The exact date and circumstances surrounding the death of Andrew Crouch is not known. The records show that the estate of Jonathon Crouch was settled in 1786 and it was Jonathon, not John Sr. that was killed by a rattlesnake bite as the legend states. Based on the David Crouch interview and deeds recorded in Randolph County all of the Crouch families, except the family of Andrew and Judith Crouch, moved from Tygart's Valley to Kentucky prior to 1800. The 1802 tax records of Randolph County shows only John Crouch, and Andrew Crouch as being heads of households and Jacob Crouch was living with Andrew Crouch, [ John, Andrew, and Jacob were all children of Andrew Crouch and Judith Westfall ]. On June 7, 1786 John Crouch, son and heir of Andrew Crouch received 210 acres of land in Randolph County, [Randolph County Deed Book 1 page 15 ]. John would have been about 12 years of age at that time and this conveyance may have been the land transfer, under the law of "primogenetin" [ giving all of the property to the eldest son ], that Fansler was referring to in his book. On March 28, 1801 John Crouch and wife Mary Nelson Crouch, [ daughter of Charles Nelson Sr. and Elizabeth Fore ] conveyed this same 210 acres of land in Randolph County to Jacob and Andrew Crouch, [ John's brother's ]Fansler states in his book that John Crouch's son, Major John Crouch, was the first white child born in what is now Randolph County. The census records show that Major John was born in 1774, however other recorded documents show that John Crouch's sons, John Jr. and Jonathon, were both born prior to his moving to Tygart's Valley. Their names appearing on the petition in 1776 would indicate that they were both over sixteen years of age at that time. Records show that the following were the children of John Crouch Sr.:

Joseph Crouch, married to Elizabeth Warwick

Andrew Crouch married to Judith Westfall

Elizabeth Crouch, married to Henry DeLay

Eleanor Crouch, married to Charles Nelson Jr.

John Crouch Jr., married to Sarah Nelson

Jonathon Crouch, died 1786 unmarried

Jacob Crouch

Sarah Crouch, married to John Ryan

David Crouch, married to Elizabeth Cassity.

For more information see Interview with David and Elizabeth Cassity Crouch

Since the above I have received additional information from Ms. Stalnaker concerning her futher studies.

John Crouch Sr. born 1728, Somerset MD, died 1800 Ross County Ohio, and wife Mary had the following children:

1. Joseph born 1748 married to Elizabeth Warwick

2. Andrew born 1750 died 1789 married to Judith Westfall

3. Elizabeth, married to Henry Delay

4. John Jr. married to Sarah Fornelson, daughter of Charles Fornelson Sr.

5. Eleanor, married first to Charles Fornelson Jr. and second to Edward McCalla

6. Sarah, married to John Ryan

7. Jonathon, died August 1786 in Randolph County WV unmarried

8. David, married to Elizabeth Cassity

I have come across tidbits of information during my research, and have had information sent to me from a Radcliff family researcher that there was indeed an additional son named Jacob, but have never been able to verify it, also, from David Crouch's interview, David's wife states that John Crouch Sr. was born on the Eastern Shores of Maryland, [which meant that earlier histories written about Randolph and surrounding counties in WV which stated he came here from Wales were incorrect,] and in fact, we have narrowed our search down to Somerset County, MD, and surrounding counties, which is where we have traced John Crouch Sr., and some of the Crouch associated families, such as Fornelson, Wamsley, Delay, among others.

This theory that John Crouch Sr. was born in Maryland is stunning to me and I certainly look forward to further developments. I personally respect Ms. Stalnaker's research abilities and know she always proceeds carefully and with through documentation. A literal reading of Elizabeth Crouch's statement does support this hypothesis.   Larry


OLDER MESSAGES FROM THIS RESEARCHER ABOUT THIS FAMILY:

Re: Elizabeth Crouch Wamsley, Randolph County WV
From: randy stalnaker <randystalnaker@webtv.net>
Time: Mon, 26-Aug-2002
Re: Elizabeth Crouch of Randolph County WV, who was the daughter of Andrew, son of John Crouch Sr., all of Randolph County WV and wife of Samuel Wamsley--
I am researching Andrew Crouch, 1750-1780, and his descendants, Andrew, being my greatx5 grandfather, Elizabeth my greatx4 grandmother, and all data I have seen published on Elizabeth states her birthdate as 1789, and I am trying to figure why most researchers accept this, when Andrew's date of death was 1780?

Here is the information I have so far on this line of the Crouch Family, from different sources, the most accurate info. I have come up with is from a fellow researcher whose interests are in the Crouch Family members from this line that moved later from Randolph County to Kentucky, my interests are with the
only members of this line who remained in Randolph County, that being the widow of Andrew Crouch, [Judith Westfall Crouch] and her 4 children: Andrew, Jacob, John, and Elizabeth.
>From The History of Tucker County, WV by Homer Floyd Fansler, Published in 1962 by McClain Printing Co. in Parsons, WV: Page 46, reference # 83: After the Indians broke up the first settlement in Tygart's Valley, nineteen years elapsed before another attempt was made to occupy that region. In 1772, a number of men from the Southbranch, and some from the Greenbriar River, moved their families into Tygart Valley, located at Beverly, Huttonsville, Elkwater, and Valley
Head. Among those colonists were the Crouches, Haddens, Warwicks, Wamsley's, Westfalls, Nelsons, and Wimoth's, all English. The Currences,, Irish, the Wilson's, Scotch, and the Stalnaker's, German. I am related to the Crouch, Wamsley, Westfall, Currence, and the Stalnaker families. In the meantime that part of Randolph County that later became Tucker County, was settled by John Crouch. The John Crouch cabin stood a half mile from the forks of the Cheat River, and a half mile from the city of Parsons, in Blackman Flats. WV Historical Marker, located near the South intersection of First and Main Streets in Parsons reads:
PARSONS, John Crouch, pioneer settler, established "tomahawk rights" here in 1766, the first settler of Tucker County WV.

 

This is a more recent post by Ms. Stalnaker

Until recently it was thought that the four children of Andrew and Judith Westfall Crouch were:
Major John Crouch, born 1773
Jacob Crouch born 1776
Elizabeth Crouch born 1779
Andrew Crouch born 1780

The exact date of death for Andrew Crouch has not been found, but the last written record for Andrew was his signature on a petition to the legislature in Augusta County, Va, dated November, 1780 to form a new county, then in a special census taken in 1782, his widow Judith Crouch is shown as head of household with 4 children in her family, so we know Andrew's death occured after November of 1780, and before 1782 when the special census was taken.
It has now been discovered that Elizabeth Crouch, married to Samuel Wamsley, and long thought to be Andrew's daughter, is not. Elizabeth Crouch Wamsley is buried at the Old Brick Church Cemetery in Huttonsville, Randolph County, WV, information from her headstone states her year of birth as 1789, several years after the death of Andrew, proving he was not her father.
Information sent to me by Michael Wamsley states that in a letter written by Mary Jane See Crouch, [wife of Major John Crouch's youngest son, John Marshall Crouch] Elizabeth was the illegetimate daughter of Judith Westfall and a traveling salesman with the last name of Clark.
So my question is, who was the fourth child of Andrew and Judith, clearly shown listed in the 1782 census and later records as well, was the child male or female, and what became of the child?
Long ago I came across information in the Warwick family researchers notes that after Joseph Crouch, [Andrew's oldest brother] and his family left Randolph County, WV, and settled in Kentuckya, Joseph sent two of is nephews on his wife's side of the family, {Warwick} to go back to Randolph County, WV and fetch the "old maid daughter" of Andrew Crouch, and bring her back to Kentucky to marry into the Warwick family. The information did not state a name for the daughter, nor were there any references for the information.
I am trying to identify the fourth child, if the child was female, the information in the notes of Warwick family researchers might be possible, if anyone has any information that could help me, I sure would appreciate it, thanks, Randy restalnaker@peoplepc.com

Contents Introduction Stephen Crouch Index Crouch Family Index Barton County Index

If you have information or photographs concerning the descendants of Stephen Douglas Crouch or the Barton County village of Nashville, Missouri, please contact me. I share my pictures and I return any photographs entrusted to me promptly.

EMAIL: stephendcrouch@pacbell.net

Larry Crouch